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Thread: LGS selling "Safe Act Compliant" ar's and Ak's. Is this correct?

  1. #1
    Sergeant
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    Default LGS selling "Safe Act Compliant" ar's and Ak's. Is this correct?

    I came across a local gunshops site and they have listed a few ar-15's and WASR ak-47's for sale and listed as "Safe Act Compliant"
    They seem to have the pistol grips removed and replaced with the horizontal grip things.

    I was under the impression that just putting on one of these oddball grips like the california legal ones didnt actually change anything. Thought I read on here that nobody knows yet if that makes it a non-assault rifle.

    So did I miss something? Can we just change out the grip? Or are these rifles not really legal to buy?

    I dont want to paste link right now as I have couple friends who I will tell first.
    But I was surprised when I came accross the listing

  2. #2
    Captain de17walt's Avatar
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    I found this place saying they have NY compliant, not sure if it is the same as your site. New "IN STOCK" Firearms for Sale
    NY CCW unrestricted
    Keep your powder dry and warm Thru the coming darkest storms
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    ya thats the same site I found.

    I didn't think just doing that to the grip bypassed all the assault weapon BS of the safe act.

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    Captain de17walt's Avatar
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    When NY ever gets around to knowing what is or isn't legal, then maybe we will finally know the answers
    NY CCW unrestricted
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    General RayKnobs's Avatar
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    No one knows 100% if the California stock is considered a feature. It will probably take someone getting arrested
    Embree Smith likes this.

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    Major loki34's Avatar
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    Believe me, NY doesn't want any configuration to be legal and will never tell you, yup good to go there buddy. They will just keep saying, nope that's still an AW you got there criminal so give it to me now.
    Embree Smith likes this.

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    General RayKnobs's Avatar
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    I think you need some long fingers for that one.

    It's obvious that the LGS is trying to get around the law and knows you'll put the grip back on when you get it home.

    Does anyone else think it's curious all the muzzles are cropped out of the pictures. I think he didn't want to undo any permanently pinned breaks till the guns sell.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RayKnobs View Post


    I think you need some long fingers for that one.

    It's obvious that the LGS is trying to get around the law and knows you'll put the grip back on when you get it home.

    Does anyone else think it's curious all the muzzles are cropped out of the pictures. I think he didn't want to undo any permanently pinned breaks till the guns sell.
    barf ........ i hate nys
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    Colonel PY-Tactical's Avatar
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    I'd say they're speculating that the Exile grip by itself won't be seen as a short pistol grip. Exile recommends their product be set up with a stock attached to the grip itself to be in true compliance. Still it's a gamble as no official approval of their product has been received. My opinion is that just using the Exile without an attached stock does not comply fully.


    Here's what I mean:

    image-1_zps91aaa444.jpg
    The first rule of AR Club is you do not talk about AR Club!

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    Quote Originally Posted by RayKnobs View Post


    I think you need some long fingers for that one.

    It's obvious that the LGS is trying to get around the law and knows you'll put the grip back on when you get it home.

    Does anyone else think it's curious all the muzzles are cropped out of the pictures. I think he didn't want to undo any permanently pinned breaks till the guns sell.
    What if I mount a maglite to it? Say, in a semi-vertical position right behind the trigger?
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    Colonel PY-Tactical's Avatar
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    Then you have a pistol grip that doubles as a flashlight.
    The first rule of AR Club is you do not talk about AR Club!

    The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws. ~ Ayn Rand

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    **** all that noise

    i'm really digging this

    Stick to your guns likes this.
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    There are two possible issues with this. One would be the handgrip. Some have gotten information from the safe act hotline that the standard AR handgrip makes it an AW. Of course the hotline has been proven to not be the most reliable. I think the AK would be fine with regards to this. The other possible issue is the question of what constitutes that a modification is reversible. I think this is more of an issue for an existing AR/AK owner trying to make it no longer classify as an AW. If you were to purchase one of these, it already doesn't have a pistol grip, so I would say you would be in the clear. This is more of an issue for the FFL IMO.

    According to what is written in the bill, I say that these are legal non-assault weapon guns. That's just my interpretation. I am not a lawyer nor an author of the act, so take what I say with a grain of salt.

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    General meketrefe's Avatar
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    No problem there just use the Cuomo Finger...
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    Major jeepyj's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PY-Tactical View Post
    Then you have a pistol grip that doubles as a flashlight.
    No, It's just a flashlight mounted to my rifle. I didn't want anyone to think I was using it to hunt at night so I mounted it at a ridiculous angle. Aimed at my feet. I guess you could hang onto the rifle that way but I think it would be kinda uncomfortable.
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    General RayKnobs's Avatar
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    Your argument might work as long as you never but your hand on it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by de17walt View Post
    I found this place saying they have NY compliant, not sure if it is the same as your site. New "IN STOCK" Firearms for Sale
    Late followup, but there are some selling with the Exile Hammerhead and "cleansed" uppers. Exile says this: NEW YORK STATE CUSTOMERS: We have confirmed with Counsel for the New York State Police (NYSP) via our attorney (Tresmond Law of Hamburg NY) that a rifle with our Hammerhead AR-15 Stock Adapter when epoxied to the rifle and with a buttstock attached to the rear threads of this product (Type I or Type II config) and no other NY-SAFE prohibited features would be considered a sporting rifle and no registration under NY-SAFE will be required.

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    Captain Jmo371's Avatar
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    The exile and the frs 15 have both been confirmed as compliant.

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    Should caution that our product is going to be compliant only with a buttstock screwed into the back. Can't just bolt the grip on and call it good like they can in California. Different laws there. These gun shops just bolting the Hammerhead on and removing all the other NY-SAFE features are deluding themselves and possibly putting themselves and their customers at risk. We have always been very clear on this, in NY you have to use the Hammerhead as a stock adapter and not as a standalone grip.
    chris22 likes this.
    Replace your Pistol Grip with a Hammerhead AR-15 Stock Adapter. Avoid NY-SAFE Rifle Registration!
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    Fixed magazine is the only safe bet IMHO
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    Colonel androokwomo's Avatar
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    "Is this correct? "

    correct? only politically. Otherwise, it's a farce. I think I'd rather stick a hot poker up my a$$ rather than buy one of those.
    thegatman likes this.
    I'll get a pistol when I no longer have to prove that I am a law abiding citizen and wait over a year for bureaucrats to be "comfortable" that I'm not a threat to society. I refuse to play their games.

    "if I repent of anything, it is very likely to be my good behavior." ~Thoreau

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    Quote Originally Posted by Exile Machine View Post
    Should caution that our product is going to be compliant only with a buttstock screwed into the back. Can't just bolt the grip on and call it good like they can in California. Different laws there. These gun shops just bolting the Hammerhead on and removing all the other NY-SAFE features are deluding themselves and possibly putting themselves and their customers at risk. We have always been very clear on this, in NY you have to use the Hammerhead as a stock adapter and not as a standalone grip.

    Even if the hammerhead grip was epoxied to the rifle? with the buttstock in the original position it would not pass?
    Is there a rational behind this?

    Who wants a buffer tube up in their face?


    Ergonomics wise, wouldn't it make sense to put a cheek rest on the buffer tube of the rifle? Something that say is adjustable comb? It may help with aesthetics of the rifle as well. Might be a money maker there. I'd rather have something there then a rubber piece eating my face apart upon recoil.

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    Corporal Exile Machine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rboss32 View Post
    Even if the hammerhead grip was epoxied to the rifle? with the buttstock in the original position it would not pass?
    Is there a rational behind this?
    This passes in California because they precisely (geometrically) define the word "pistol grip" in their law. New York law has no such definition. It would be up to a local jury whether they thought a Hammerhead as a standalone grip would be considered a pistol grip in New York State. If you're willing to take that chance, go for it. We strongly advise against it and the NY state police agree. Make it part of a buttstock and there's no question it's no longer a pistol grip. It's a stock.

    Who wants a buffer tube up in their face?
    Thousands of customers in both California and New York State. It's really quite comfortable, whether you put a rubber or foam sleeve over it or not. Don't forget that this is also the way millions of AR-pistol shooters operate.

    Ergonomics wise, wouldn't it make sense to put a cheek rest on the buffer tube of the rifle? Something that say is adjustable comb? It may help with aesthetics of the rifle as well. Might be a money maker there. I'd rather have something there then a rubber piece eating my face apart upon recoil.
    That's the beauty of the AR-15 modular rifle platform. If that's what you want, you can have it. The market already supplies the parts. All you have to do is purchase them and install. We sell these CAA stock saddles that work well over the pistol buffer tubes. We have them in three different colors to match your furniture color, though we have found that most of our New York customers go black.
    Replace your Pistol Grip with a Hammerhead AR-15 Stock Adapter. Avoid NY-SAFE Rifle Registration!
    www.exilemachine.com

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    Quote Originally Posted by androokwomo View Post
    "Is this correct? "

    correct? only politically. Otherwise, it's a farce. I think I'd rather stick a hot poker up my a$$ rather than buy one of those.
    EDIT: Nothing personal to the manufacturer, I think it's awesome that peeps are trying to find ways around the stupid legislation. I'm just from the school of thought that we shouldn't have to do this, and doing so is a form of compliance.
    I'll get a pistol when I no longer have to prove that I am a law abiding citizen and wait over a year for bureaucrats to be "comfortable" that I'm not a threat to society. I refuse to play their games.

    "if I repent of anything, it is very likely to be my good behavior." ~Thoreau

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    Quote Originally Posted by Exile Machine View Post
    This passes in California because they precisely (geometrically) define the word "pistol grip" in their law. New York law has no such definition. It would be up to a local jury whether they thought a Hammerhead as a standalone grip would be considered a pistol grip in New York State. If you're willing to take that chance, go for it. We strongly advise against it and the NY state police agree. Make it part of a buttstock and there's no question it's no longer a pistol grip. It's a stock.

    Thousands of customers in both California and New York State. It's really quite comfortable, whether you put a rubber or foam sleeve over it or not. Don't forget that this is also the way millions of AR-pistol shooters operate.


    That's the beauty of the AR-15 modular rifle platform. If that's what you want, you can have it. The market already supplies the parts. All you have to do is purchase them and install. We sell these CAA stock saddles that work well over the pistol buffer tubes. We have them in three different colors to match your furniture color, though we have found that most of our New York customers go black.
    I have already 6 exile adaptors ready to install. With other systems I am taking a different route as they are long range PRS stock type.
    Do you have any images of the saddles and the stock/ tubes all together?
    Giving money and power to Government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. -- P.J. O'Rourke






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