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Thread: .358/.25 WSSM. The "BIG MOMMA" Elephant Popper in AR15 (might need titanium billet! )

  1. #1
    General meketrefe's Avatar
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    Cog .358/.25 WSSM. The "BIG MOMMA" Elephant Popper in AR15 (might need titanium billet! )

    I have been thinking about this for a while. Sometimes it takes one year or more for me to decide the next upper, sometimes just the urge or impulse. ....sounds familiar? LOL!
    I do like the 458 but I do see other very attractive options in the big bore. The socom is a great cartrige but somehow limited taking into account the investment.


    I have been thinking in building a new cartrige from scratch that is super easy and gives better ballistic performance than any of the thumpers out there but I came across the .358/.25 WSSM that folks are using for the Indiana Legal option. What I mean with this it offers superior terminal ballistics from the start but the most important it is a huge bullet able to carry lethal power all the way to the 400 yards. Lets put it this way.. the 'bigga' bullet carries almost the same energy at 400 yards than a 6.8SPC at the muzzle. You can hunt elephants with this.


    Here is some pics I found from dtec and others already cutting barrels....





    Now look at these numbers. No other AR-15 thumper can even begin to compare to this and the reason is very simple, although there are others 'bewolfers' out there with substantial punch at the muzzle these are big bullets they can still be considered ballistically efficient. Terminal effects are devastating.


    .358/.25 WSSM - 225gr SBT 20"


    Range (Yds) 0 100 200 300 400 500 600 700
    Speed (fps) 2587 2352 2134 1931 1743 1569 1409 1261
    Energy (ft.lb) 3343 2764 2275 1863 1518 1230 991 794
    Drop (in) 0.00 2.77 11.84 28.57 54.67 92.32 144.27 214.11
    Path (in) -1.50 2.40 0.00 -10.06 -29.50 -60.48 -105.76 -168.93
    Elevn(MOA) -2.29 0.00 3.19 7.02 11.52 16.79 22.98
    Windage(MOA) 0.48 0.99 1.55 2.17 2.84 3.58 4.40
    Time(Sec) 0.00 0.12 0.26 0.40 0.57 0.75 0.95 1.18

    Ñaka ñaka...
    Giving money and power to Government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. -- P.J. O'Rourke






  2. #2
    General Gunner57's Avatar
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    You are a very sick person!

    I want one too though!!
    default14845 likes this.

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    General Evild's Avatar
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    First of all, you gotta change your pic, it freaks me out, and secondly, I want one too.
    45 Kills your soul.

    MOLON LABE!

  4. #4
    General meketrefe's Avatar
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    I hate bad bullets as much as I hate ugly chicks, cheap wine and current politics.
    So I see this as a much more attractive and effective option than the 50cal 300gr bullet that flies with the landing flaps down.
    Some loyalists are going to say: SATANAS!!!!! ...but I am just saying what I see.

    ...the gears are already spinning....
    Last edited by meketrefe; 11-29-2011 at 11:09 PM.
    Giving money and power to Government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. -- P.J. O'Rourke






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    Colonel ECU Pirates's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meketrefe View Post
    I hate bad bullets as much as I hate ugly chicks, cheap wine and current politics.
    So I see this as a much more attractive and effective option than the 50cal 300gr bullet that flies with the landing flaps down.
    Some loyalists are going to say: SATANAS!!!!! ...but I am just saying what I see.

    ...the gears are already spinning....
    Cheap wine leads to ugly chicks. Learned that in college. I agree that you should change your pic and I also want one.
    Tactical Failure likes this.

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    Major RDFABSREP's Avatar
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    Just to play Devil's advocate...do you plan on hunting elephants? I was considering a Beowulf build mainly due to the "cool" factor and I thought having a carbine in a platform I was wildly familiar with would be fun. But in the end, what the hell would I do with this? I'd spend a mint on ammo and probably never actually be able to utilize it in a combat/hunting scenario.

    Just my $0.02; maybe it'll help you make a decision, either way.
    “Disconnect and self destruct one bullet at a time
    What's your rush, now? Everyone will have his day to die." -APC

    This Too Shall Pass

  7. #7
    General meketrefe's Avatar
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    There is never a bad honest question, only bad answers. Your question makes total sense.
    The folks in Indiana for example do not have any other choice, they use this or any of the other thumpers but the issue is range. Ballistically this is superior to most other thumper bullets but it is sort of in the thumper category by itself. Specifically less drag deceleration with very decent sectional density.
    No doubt they will let you hunt a biggest games (ie grizzly) at least with the Beowolf but that problem would you feel comfortable if the shot was needed out to 200 or well past 200 yards? Not recommended.
    Obviously to everyone each own but I wanted to post my thoughts. This might not be your purpose, but there are many other users and purposes out there.
    Actually this is the way we should approach any firearm we are considering and stay away from fashions....
    -What purpose?
    -What is the best bullet/s I need for that purpose?
    -What is a good case option to push that bullet and what barrel I need?
    -Will I enjoy reloading? Is this is even a good option to learn reloading?
    -Can I afford it to shoot many rounds and have funds to enjoy it or is for show?. maybe consider two barrels at once.
    -Do I need training to understand how to best use of this round. Training is very important and most of the time overlooked. This is where the big dollars should go if one is serious about getting good at shooting for example long range or other special type of hunting.
    -Will I really enjoy it or this is imposed due to fashion or peer pressure? ask the guy in the mirror.
    -Is the geek inside of me and I really love the Horse Power of Accuracy or both of this cartrige?

    And then decide this way, pragmatically, and not jump into the first thing we see online, TV or magazines.

    For most of the average folks very few things I can think cannot be done by a 5.56 or just ramp it up a tad with a nice and simple 6x45 or a nice 6.8SPC or a grendel/LBC depending on purpose or preferences.
    But there might be situations where a big bad ass bullet might be the preferred choice.

    The AR15 is the current legos of the firearms industry. Other than the .223 and 7.62x39 no other AR-15 cartridges are as widely popular cartridge option in the bolt action department so we love these new stubby cartridges because we love the AR15.

    Let the doers decide the how to.
    Last edited by meketrefe; 11-30-2011 at 01:47 AM.
    Giving money and power to Government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. -- P.J. O'Rourke






  8. #8
    General meketrefe's Avatar
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    I am just concerned about the bolt thrust more than anything else.
    They come with a solid promise guaranteed but I don't know.
    The cases are super strong, that I know.
    Giving money and power to Government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. -- P.J. O'Rourke






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    Super Moderator evileyeswatchin's Avatar
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    Consider my curiosity piqued.
    My mind is the weapon, everything else is merely an accessory.

    . . .|====|
    *n/______\n*
    =(OxxxxO)=

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    Major bockerSV's Avatar
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    ^+1

  11. #11
    General meketrefe's Avatar
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    Well if this round doesn't work out for whatever reason we should go for this one for the next upper...



    LOL!
    Giving money and power to Government is like giving whiskey and car keys to teenage boys. -- P.J. O'Rourke






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    Sergeant SteveNY's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by meketrefe View Post
    Well if this round doesn't work out for whatever reason we should go for this one for the next upper...



    LOL!
    I refuse to use rounds that are bigger than my manhood.

  13. #13
    General meketrefe's Avatar
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    I have not decided yet if I will use the WSSM or the 308w bolt face cases as a thumper baseline but I have a friend who has reloaded the WSSM cases up to 20 times before they lost primer pocket pressure. The other option is a 358 based on an expanded and enlarged BR case but I will also try to make it from the 308w case. 220 to 240grains would be the ideal I think.
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  14. #14
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    That muzzle energy is off the charts crazy. Wow.
    "You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass." - Admiral Isoruko Yamamota

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    Sergeant default14845's Avatar
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    Iv'e been anticipating this, and...I guess I will continue too...lol this sounds really good to me though!

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    Check out Dtech they sell uppers complete for 1,049 . I live in indiana and already have a aa beowulf and this is next

  17. #17
    General meketrefe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by buhmannc View Post
    Check out Dtech they sell uppers complete for 1,049 . I live in indiana and already have a aa beowulf and this is next
    Thanks. I know some they are going that way because of the stupid arbitrary laws and this one is a nice option with plenty of brass in stock.
    I am still concerned about the backthrust and looking at option to fireforming like hydro-forming on this type of case. I know the cases are
    extremely strong.
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  18. #18
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    BFG also sells formed brass and barrels

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    IDF
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    Quote Originally Posted by RDFABSREP View Post
    Just to play Devil's advocate...do you plan on hunting elephants? I was considering a Beowulf build mainly due to the "cool" factor and I thought having a carbine in a platform I was wildly familiar with would be fun. But in the end, what the hell would I do with this? I'd spend a mint on ammo and probably never actually be able to utilize it in a combat/hunting scenario.

    Just my $0.02; maybe it'll help you make a decision, either way.
    exactly what i did. spent a ton building it and then bought a lot of hard to get expensive ammo and never use it. but i regret nothing because i got it!
    happy april 15th!

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