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Thread: Gun owners willing to part with "black guns"

  1. #1
    Sergeant
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    Default Gun owners willing to part with "black guns"

    I have coffee with a good crowd of gun owners. Talking about new gun laws and most of them are more than willing to throw the black guns under the buss to keep theirs. Most see no reason for anyone to have an AK/AR let alone 30 round mags or even 10 round guns as in SKS. If gun owners can't stick together any better than this we are all SOL.

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    General RayKnobs's Avatar
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    Just because you own a gun it doesn't mean you are smart. When they lose their gun enjoy a good " i told you so"

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    Colonel PY-Tactical's Avatar
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    That's pretty common out there. I hear that all the time. They are being pretty short sighted.
    The first rule of AR Club is you do not talk about AR Club!

    The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals. Well, when there aren't enough criminals, one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws. ~ Ayn Rand

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    Colonel DrgnFly's Avatar
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    I guess it will finally hit them when it's "too late". See if they post up their 30rnd magazines here.. I'll buy some. Even give them a nice $20 bill each.
    randy41508 likes this.

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    General dsdmmat's Avatar
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    Well the ban being talked about includes the M1 Carbine, and other semi autos that accept a detachable magazine.
    Manus haec inimica tyrannis
    The sheepdog does not concern himself with the opinions of the sheep.

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    Major timmyp's Avatar
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    Bravo Company had a good post on their FB page talking about this:


    Please share this information on your FaceBook page in the hope that other folks in the “I support the 2nd Amendment, but don’t want people to have AR15 rifles” crowd get a better real understanding of the issues at stake.
    If we don’t get these folks involved and on our side, the 2nd Amendment will eventually be completely eroded. There is so much misinformation put out there by the gun-grabbers and then repeated by the media. Let's take a moment to clear up some of that misinformation.

    1) Civilian AR-15 rifles are NOT the same automatic weapons the Military has. The military has fully automatic weapons. Civilian AR-15s in production today do NOT. They shoot one shot per trigger pull, just like a semi auto hunting rifle. I know often the when the media makes commentary they show B-roll video in the background of a machine gun shooting and spraying, but that is not how civilian AR-15 rifles operate.

    2) Civilian AR-15 rifles (or similar) has the same type of internals as your semi auto deer rifle. Civilian type "assault" rifles function the exact same way as deer hunting rifles. They just look different.

    3) Even the term “assault” rifle is gun grabber sensationalism parroted by the media. “Assault” weapons are fully automatic (select fire), and they have been heavily regulated since the 1930s, and civilian manufacturer has been completely outlawed almost 30 years ago!!

    4) ”AK-47s” have already been banned from manufacture from civilians, also almost 30 years ago. Again the civilian look-a-like rifles have the same type of semi auto internals as your hunting rifle. Different cosmetics, same type of mechanics.

    5) An AR15 (or similar) is NOT a “high powered rifle”. I guess it depends on what you want to categorize as “high power”, but these rifles shoot some of the smallest rifle cartridges in the market. Deer rifles are a LOT more powerful than any of these rifles. And soon the gun-grabbing crowd will recategorize your deer rifle as a “high powered sniper rifle”. That is how this political movement works.

    6) A hunting shotgun is a LOT more lethal in these close quarter mass killings of unarmed innocent people than any semi auto rifle. Anyone with extensive firearms training and experience will confirm that.

    The politicians know these new laws will NOT stop these types of mass killings. They even admit it! But they want to pass them anyway because it serves their greater mission of effectively neutering the second amendment. The leaders in this movement actually DON’T WANT these laws to work (even if they would) because when they are shown ineffective, they now have the political momentum to pass more ineffective laws, and grab more guns.

    This is all part of a broader gun grab, done slowly, in increments, over time, until the Second Amendment is just a bunch of meaningless outdated words on an old piece of parchment.

    When a sociopath chooses that shotgun or hunting rifle in the next horrific event, you are the legislature’s next target.

    The philosophy of “We need to pass more laws to stop sociopathic criminals from breaking our laws” is effective because most Americans are not really paying attention to these details. (Please read that line twice) Please help to educate the public with this information.

    Also it should be noted, the 2nd Amendment has NOTHING to do with hunting, fishing, competitive shooting, “sporting purposes”, racquet ball, swimming, camping, etc. The 2nd Amendment (and the entire Bill of Rights) is to preserve a balance of power between the citizens and their government.
    "We, the people are the rightful masters of both Congress and the courts, not to overthrow the Constitution, but to overthrow men who pervert the Constitution." Abraham Lincoln

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    Colonel Carabiner's Avatar
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    m1 carbine, m1 garand, thompson semi, and on, it's a complete disarmament, you can't resist an army with shotguns, and congress has no right to infringe on the 2nd.

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    tell them after the black guns are gone, thier guns will be the new black guns. especially after someone does something horrible with a type of gun that they are in favor of.
    jmac00 and jsado like this.

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    Your friends are what are known as "fudds"; casual gun owners with no serious appreciation for the 2nd Amendment and what it truly stands for.
    BIG flash, jmac00, k2jlx and 10 others like this.


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    Quote Originally Posted by Carabiner View Post
    m1 carbine, m1 garand, thompson semi, and on, it's a complete disarmament, you can't resist an army with shotguns, and congress has no right to infringe on the 2nd.
    ...nor does the president, nor the judiciary. The only way a modification can be made is by LEGAL means - an amendment can be repealed by a states convention after a two thirds majority of CONGRESS proposes the amendment (which would repeal another amendment): lookup the 21st amendment - repealed the 18th amendment which was Prohibition.
    Here's an Interesting view of the issue: Repeal of the 2nd Amendment would not Abolish any Right – Tenth Amendment Center
    Essentially, the right to keep and bear arms, or any other right for that matter, is NOT granted the people by their government and therefore cannot be taken away or abolished.

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    My friend just got his ccw in erie county and said he doesnt care if they take it away. I start to seize when he says stuff like that.

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    Secession sounds good right about now...this is a freaking mess.

  13. #13
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    I have read that the grandfather clause will allow owners to keep their guns, if they register them.

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    My stepfather unfortunately feels the same way, which was a big surprise to me. He seems to think ar15s aren't necessary for anything and that only nuts want to have a military styled rifle. You'd be surprised how many gun owners really feel this way. The "If it doesn't affect me I don't care" mentality is pretty strong too.
    jmpaolic likes this.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Instamark View Post
    I have read that the grandfather clause will allow owners to keep their guns, if they register them.
    Yes and never sell or give them to anyone else and when you die the government gets them and not your children.
    NYSRPA Member - SCOPE Member - NRA Life Member - NRA Range Safety Officer

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    JPP
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    yup, typical NY gun owner.....we are, where we are because of crazy liberal politicians and gun owners who are short-sighted.
    When you surrender some freedom, you open yourself up for more freedom being taken.
    loubanner and real3175 like this.
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    Start referring to their hunting rifles as "sniper rifles" that only an assassin would use and shotguns as "indiscriminate crowd-killers" preferred by lunatic mass-murderers. See if it dawns on them the word game that is being played by those using the term "assault rifle".
    defilade, demerson, RSBH44 and 8 others like this.

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    I was at Gander in New Hartford and an older gent was talking to the guy behind the counter.
    "I'm buying a revolver because when they outlaw the semi-automatic pistols, i don't want something that isn't worth anything and I know this (revolver) will be worth something."

    I wanted to scream......
    RPD 46

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    Quote Originally Posted by capitalcrew View Post
    My stepfather unfortunately feels the same way, which was a big surprise to me. He seems to think ar15s aren't necessary for anything and that only nuts want to have a military styled rifle. You'd be surprised how many gun owners really feel this way. The "If it doesn't affect me I don't care" mentality is pretty strong too.
    I've had too many say that...."no one but police and military need them...."
    They forget that this is just the beginning of taking away our rights.
    Who needs an SUV?
    or a pickup unless you own a business!
    "Sorry, without a DBA, you can't buy a truck. We have some nice Priuses over here for you to look at. One color only...step this way kind Sir."
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    We have seen the enemy and he is us.
    Jeff, jmac00, WarrenDee and 1 others like this.
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    General ladder13's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Doc8404 View Post
    I was at Gander in New Hartford and an older gent was talking to the guy behind the counter.
    "I'm buying a revolver because when they outlaw the semi-automatic pistols, i don't want something that isn't worth anything and I know this (revolver) will be worth something."

    I wanted to scream......
    i AM screaming! Less revolvers for me, hope it wasn't a S&W.
    No Tupperware allowed in my safe.

  22. #22
    Colonel Doc8404's Avatar
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    642!
    RPD 46

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    Corporal T.Webb's Avatar
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    Hey ... I don't really NEED an AR 15.
    But when they come to take away my Constitutionally guaranteed rights, well ... then I'm going to NEED it.
    BIG flash, Gunny, sr20sean and 1 others like this.
    "If everyone is thinking alike, then someone isn't thinking" ... General George S. Patton.

    "Tonight, we are a country awakened to danger and called to defend freedom. Our grief has turned to anger and anger to resolution. Whether we bring our enemies to justice or bring justice to our enemies, justice will be done". {George W. Bush, Post 9/11}

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    Those people are known as Fudds. They don't care what happens as long as nobody messes with their hunting rifles and shotguns. Well guess what Elmer, that hunting rifle is soon to be a "high powered sniper rifle". We either stand together or surely hang separately. These are the same guys that are *****ing ab out EBR's at various ranges. When will they wake up? Probably never unfortunately.
    Haze and DrgnFly like this.
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  25. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Instamark View Post
    I have read that the grandfather clause will allow owners to keep their guns, if they register them.
    And make them NFA
    Which requires the following:

    Under the NFA rules, ATF Form 4 is required to be completed in duplicate to start the process of acquiring most NFA weapons. Also, fingerprint cards, recent photos of the applicant, and Form 5330.20 certifying US Citizenship are required and a $200 Tax Stamp is to be bought for each weapon transaction submitted. The paperwork requires a signature by a Chief Law Enforcement Officer (CLEO) which could be a Chief-of- Police, Sheriff, State or Federal Judge. These hoops have to be jumped through for every machinegun purchased and transferred. Other items covered under the NFA rules are suppressors, short barreled rifles and shotguns, "any other weapons," and destructive devices. Same paperwork, tax stamp, fingerprints, photos, citizenship card, and signature required. After the paperwork is received, an extensive background check of the applicant is done, fingerprints are run by the FBI and BATFE, and if all is in order, approval is granted Then, ATF Form 4, fingerprints, and photos are filed with the BATFE and the duplicate ATF Form 4 with cancelled tax stamp is sent to the transferor.

    Machineguns are ILLEGAL for individuals in DE, DC, HI, IA, IL, KS, MI, NJ, NY, RI, WA, and SC.Suppressors are ILLEGAL for individuals in CA, DE, DC, HI, KS, IL, MN, MO, MS, MT, NY, NJ, and RI.Short Barreled Rifles are ILLEGAL for individuals in: AL, HI, IL, NJ, NY, RI, and WA.Short Barreled Shotguns are ILLEGAL for individuals in: AL, DE, HI, IL, IN, KS, MA, NJ, NY, RI, and WA.
    Guess what state doesn't allow NFA weapons? Yup. THIS ONE. Unless you're a class 3 dealer... which I'm sure we all are right?



    Don't get complacent.
    Last edited by llockejr; 12-28-2012 at 10:10 PM.

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