Organizing Friends & Family for Liberty
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  1. #1
    Major John Stark's Avatar
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    Default Organizing Friends & Family for Liberty

    UPDATE: Meet & Greet is Feb. 22nd, 10 AM @: http://www.ontariorodandgun.com/

    RSVP by PM to me by Feb. 15th!!!

    Details are in post #90 in this thread:
    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/law...tml#post739286
    There's been a lot of talk on these boards about NYF members doing some organizing of their own, and I've had inquiries into whether or not I'm interested in being a part of that.

    For those that have not read some of the threads, I have posted them at this end of this post for your perusal.

    Before I continue, let me state that I have the permission of Tim, one of the fine administrators here at NYF, to post this, and his approval and time is much appreciated, as is that of all of the other admins, moderators, owners of this site, and so on. Nothing in this post is to be construed, however, as the promotion of a "New York Firearms" official event, organization, movement, or salad bar. NYF has given its kind consent for me to promote some organizing of NYF members that have shown an interest in getting together to move the ball forward for repeal of the UnSafe Act, and to hinder or stop any future gun control legislation in NY. We are much obliged to NYF for this opportunity, and for these forums.

    In the interests of full disclosure, I stipulate that I am a life-time member of the Republican party (although they aren't worth a damn these days it seems), and a life time voter. Otherwise, I have no official affiliation with any other organization for the purposes of promoting, expanding, or recruiting for anyone. I am nothing more than an ordinary tax payer, gun owner, family man, and working class schmuck. I have no special connections, I'm not rich or famous, and I am not in the pocket of anyone. Furthermore, I am NOT holding my hand out looking for money.

    I do however take the Constitution and the writings of our Founding Fathers seriously, and that is my passion and raison d'etre. Liberty is my game, and Patriot is my name. If you are of like mind, read on.

    Anyone that is interested in getting something new in NY off the ground, and working towards something long term, through hard work and rolling up the sleeves, feel free to post here with your support of getting started, ideas you have about goals and how to meet them, and so on. Albany wasn't built in a day, and its going to take a lot of time and effort to roll things back. Please feel free to ask questions, or PM me if you want to talk privately.

    So with all of that aside, here is my initial proposal for getting something off the ground, and some of the ideas that have been batted back and forth:

    -Meet & Greet to get things off the ground. Time and place as yet to be determined.

    -Establish gun clubs, shooting competitions, and firearms associations in every town and county. These gun clubs are for promoting self-defense, the shooting sports, and for mutual assistance and support.

    -A loose organization that is not top down, but bottom up. Each affiliate in each town or county is in charge of their own local priorities.

    -Firearms Legal Association: through dues that go strictly towards legal fees and retainers, a legal association is formed that offers a legal team that will defened anyone in the association against charges stemming strictly from gun control laws that violate the Constitution. No other wrong doing or crimes are eligible for legal help from the FLA. Similar to homeschooling legal associations.

    -Reloading clubs: like-minded individuals get together and pool resources to help one another learn reloading, produce ammunition for themselves, and promote reloading as a hobby and another component of safe, effective gun ownership.

    -Media Push: New media is likely the best way to go, but no effort to reach out to like-minded individuals will be discounted. We use all media tools available to us to get the pro-gun, Constitutional message out to the masses. We need passionate speakers that can stay on message and aren't afriad of conflict.

    -The Constitutional & Founding Documents Hit Squad: we start amongst ourselves to get up to speed on the Constitution and the other writings of the Founding Fathers; once we are secure in our talking points and polemics, we work on bring more of the People back to the Constitutional fold and on the side of Freedom.

    -Non-exclusive Outreach: we reach out to other groups to coordinate rallies, protests, and other means by which we can poke a finger in Andy's eye. We seek to draw in members of the NRA, NYSRPA, SCOPE, and so on, not to steal their members, but to get them more active in the fight against UnSafe and any other future Infringment. Also includes Outreach to law enforcement, politicians, lawyers, political activists, and big name types in the media that are sympathetic to our causes (pro-2a, pro-Constitution, etc.).

    -T-shirts, bumper stickers, and sign geared toward promoting the writings of the Founders, the Constitution and other Founding documents, gun rights, and Liberty.

    -We Bear to Keep: this is the biggie, the whole enchilada; we push for armed rallies to show that law-abiding citizens are not criminals, and are to be trusted to Bear their arms in safety and peaceful intent. This one will separate the men from the boys.

    -Constitutional Carry: a no-holds barred approach to gun rights. We want to be like Vermont, Arizona, and the other states that require no permits or registration to buy, own, Keep, or Bear arms. NICS check and that's it.

    -Preparedness: Place an emphasis on stocking ammunition and firearms, as well as adequate food, water, heating supplies, and so on, in case of a natural disaster or other state of emergency.

    -Contacts: Each member should have "go-to" contacts in their immediate area; all members will be encouraged to support other members when needed, and to build a social network with like-minded people; think of this as a "good neighbors" policy.

    -New Gun Ranges: given the BS rules at some places that are denying the use of their facilities to black gun owners, restricting shooters from loading 10 rounds in a magazine at the range, and so on, we will seek to establish new gun ranges that are full-throttle 2nd Amendment supporters, and actively interested in expanding gun rights in every way possible.

    -Events: We need more events like the Shot Heard Round the State; that was a great day of Freedom, and we sorely need more of that to boost morale and get the message out.

    -Defiance: We are not going to kowtow to the bastards in Albany; we have our Rights, and we aim to keep them and hand them down to our Posterity.

    -Research to Connect the Dots: A coordinated effort to connect the dots on efforts to curtail Constitutional Rights, political corruption, Tyranny in the US, and so on. Everyone has an area of expertise they are trained in, interests, and hobby reading, so everyone can contribute to "connecting the dots" research. We pool our research to offer hard hitting, fact based analysis of what is going on in this state, and in the country as a whole. This would include opposition research against our political enemies who want to curtail rights. This would be no BS research, and sourced and double checked for accuracy.

    -Grass Roots: bottom up, not top down; the individual is valued over and above the collective.

    EDIT: Knowledge Base: We have a tremendous amount of expertise and hobby interest in firearms, and all sorts of other stuff. Why not pool that information and build upon it to help in the education process? Along with this, we could have a "Recommended Reading List" to help others help themselves get informed and motivated.

    -------------------

    All of this is long-term strategy, with little to no planning or tactics applied at this point, and reflects some of the sentiments expressed on these forums. Making something requires making goals, long term planning, lots of time and effort, and most importantly Conviction and Patience to keep at it. Its Pie in the Sky at this point, but I like pie, and I'm willing to grab for it if others are interested in doing so as well.

    Thank you for your time.

    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/law...low-nyers.html

    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/law...-organize.html

    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/law...-1-2014-a.html

    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/law...-safe-act.html

    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/law...-together.html

    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/law...-safe-act.html

    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/law...ct-slated.html

    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/law...cate-role.html

    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/amm...x-sign-up.html

    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/fir...mans-club.html

    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/law...upport-2a.html

    http://www.nyfirearms.com/forums/amm...quip-free.html
    Last edited by John Stark; 02-03-2014 at 11:34 PM.
    "My soul is among lions; I must lie among those who breathe forth fire, even the sons of men, whose teeth are spears and arrows and their tongue a sharp sword." Psalm 57:4

    "Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils." -Major General John Stark

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  3. #2
    Major terzmo's Avatar
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    At this point in time, not diminishing the value of the other suggestions, WE need to organize as many people as possible to vote the furher out. Energy,dollars, spreading the word relentlessly. I started when this crap act was signed...I ran into alot of friends and family that say "why bother? the furher will win"...Well...I have a bunch thinking the other way and after alot of conversation,have alot rev'd up to vote in the Fall....Fall of daz furher in the coming election ! I've never been active in politics.....Albany PI$$ed me off and now albany has to deal with it.

  4. #3
    Major blackpowdershooter30's Avatar
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    im in john keep me posted
    The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants.
    Thomas Jefferson two year NRA member
    scope member due to a good man thanks again! Flintlocks being shot is almost as better as sex thanks robin!

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  6. #4
    Colonel loki34's Avatar
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    This, on paper looks great and I'm for it, but it will be an uphill climb for sure. I can tell that you have put a lot of thought into this an appreciate that. I will look forward to more information and will participate in my area. Thanks for the work your doing.

  7. #5
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    Interested

  8. #6
    Corporal SecondThoughts's Avatar
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    Excellent post, John. Thanks and kudos to you for taking this to the next level - it's a big commitment, but I can't think of a better cause. You know my position on this - I'm ready to help with anything I can.

    Molon Labe.
    "Freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction. We didn't pass it to our children in the bloodstream. It must be fought for, protected, and handed on for them to do the same, or one day we will spend our sunset years telling our children and our children's children what it was once like in the United States where men were free." -- Ronald Reagan


  9. #7
    Captain bear arms's Avatar
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    I am in. What about a Picnic Centrally located in May ? We need to meet and establish leaders.
    Last edited by bear arms; 01-26-2014 at 08:46 AM.
    There can be No Free speech, No Freedom from Oppression, No Freedom to Worship your God, No Freedom to speak your mind, No Freedom from Fear, No Freedom for your children or theirs for anyone anywhere Without the 2ndAmendment and The Freedom to Fight for it. CHARLTON HESTON

  10. #8
    General thecelt's Avatar
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    Ive skimmed this but am going to give this a thorough reading tomorrow when i dont have my monkeys climbing on me. I have a range day planned for anyone in driving distance come spting time so we can all "shoot the ****". Ive got some ideas i am marinating and will share them after i read this in quiet. Good stuff mr.stark.
    "If there must be trouble, let it be in my day, that my child may have peace"
    All statements and opinions made here are for discussion purposes only, and not meant to promote any illegal behavior or activity.

  11. #9
    Captain LokNLoad45's Avatar
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    John you know I'm on board as I contacted you privately about doing this. While we have a good sized "army" of NYF members, we're just a speck of what we need to get organized to fight these injustices. My thoughts with John were to build the framework for each us to reach out in our local communities and educate the low information citizen. It's easy for us gun owners to rally around our cause, but we need a concerted effort to reach our family members and neighbors. And it's not just about firearms that needs to be addressed. I have the tendency of getting off track of my message and think something like this would be very helpful to me and many others here.

    I can go through John's post above and name about 5 or 6 areas where I feel I can contribute. But, like most of us here, time demands for other "life" issues limit what I can effectively do. But with an organized effort we all can have quite an impact. One thought of having meeting to get things started was the oft addressed issue of moles. Then I realized that we have nothing to hide if we stick to truth, and Constitutional facts and virtues.

    Being from the Mohawk Valley area, Utica/Herkimer vicinity, I'd be willing to help coordinate efforts here.
    Sons of Liberty Part II


    Behind Every Blade of Grass!

  12. #10
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    Count me in. I'm not sure how much I can contribute, but I'll do my best.
    "In practice what is an atheist? An atheist is just somebody who feels about Yahweh the way any decent Christian feels about Thor or Ba'al or The Golden Calf. As has been said before we are all atheists about most of the gods that humanity has ever believed in, some of us just go one god further."
    -Richard Dawkins "Militant Atheism"

  13. #11
    Major aNskY's Avatar
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    Not to be a downer, but how are we going to get our own to make a real commitment when most wont even get off the sofa for 20 minutes to vote?

  14. #12
    Captain bear arms's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aNskY View Post
    Not to be a downer, but how are we going to get our own to make a real commitment when most wont even get off the sofa for 20 minutes to vote?
    It is your duty to change this, if only by a few. If a few organize many will follow, with the right leader, information and marketing plan, We can win back our freedom. As stated this cannot happen over night.
    There can be No Free speech, No Freedom from Oppression, No Freedom to Worship your God, No Freedom to speak your mind, No Freedom from Fear, No Freedom for your children or theirs for anyone anywhere Without the 2ndAmendment and The Freedom to Fight for it. CHARLTON HESTON

  15. #13
    Major John Stark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bear arms View Post
    I am in. What about a Picnic Centrally located in May ? We need to meet and establish leaders.
    Quote Originally Posted by thecelt View Post
    I have a range day planned for anyone in driving distance come spting time so we can all "shoot the ****".
    This was exactly the kind of thing I was thinking about. Nothing says Liberty like holding Freedom in your hands and launching a few down range with like-minded friends.

    A BBQ at my house, with some shooting and a camp fire, was something I was considering for the Meet & Greet, but my wife was uncomfortable with having strangers she's never met rolling into the driveway heavily armed, heh. I haven't built my range yet either, so she has safety concerns and so on.

    She might be open to a meeting on our spread, using our 3.5 car garage in case of inclement weather, but she's not decided on that yet.

    So, a different venue may need to be found. Either we find something indoors and private to do the Meet & Greet as soon as possible, or perhaps we hold out until the weather at least gets above freezing and have a meeting at a state park or something similar.

    Main reason I was thinking about doing it at my place was because it would keep costs low, and because I know it would be a private meeting place.
    "My soul is among lions; I must lie among those who breathe forth fire, even the sons of men, whose teeth are spears and arrows and their tongue a sharp sword." Psalm 57:4

    "Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils." -Major General John Stark

  16. #14
    Colonel catskillkid's Avatar
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    I'm in, as long as we're complementing (not duplicating and thus wasting resources) efforts of other groups out there.
    NRA * GOA * NYSRPA * SCOPE * SAF

    “That rifle hanging on the wall of the working-class flat or labourer’s cottage is the symbol of democracy. It is our job to see that it stays there.” - George Orwell

  17. #15
    Major John Stark's Avatar
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    One other thing about all of this.

    I'm not trying to be the Dear Leader on this. I'm simply trying to help facilitate the desire by some on these boards to get together and get the ball rolling.

    Frankly, if I could go back to minding my own business and living my life without interference by the likes of Son of Mario, that would suit me just fine.

    UnSafe is the final straw though, and voting and donating and encouraging others to do the same for years isn't enough on my part any longer.
    "My soul is among lions; I must lie among those who breathe forth fire, even the sons of men, whose teeth are spears and arrows and their tongue a sharp sword." Psalm 57:4

    "Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils." -Major General John Stark

  18. #16
    Major John Stark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by catskillkid View Post
    I'm in, as long as we're complementing (not duplicating and thus wasting resources) efforts of other groups out there.
    Agree 100% with this.

    Encouraging everyone to get involved with the NRA, NYSPRA, SCOPE, GOA, the 2nd Amendment Foundation, or whatever other brand or organization they prefer, is a component of this. We're not stepping on toes here, we're adding toes to the foot that already exists.

    This is more about friends and family getting together with their neighbors, and rebuilding the community we've lost in this state.

    Rather than Anonymous, we will be Unanimous.
    "My soul is among lions; I must lie among those who breathe forth fire, even the sons of men, whose teeth are spears and arrows and their tongue a sharp sword." Psalm 57:4

    "Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils." -Major General John Stark

  19. #17
    Sergeant flushermgti's Avatar
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    I like your ideas, how will this organization differ from NYSRPA and SCOPE?

  20. #18
    Colonel Baby Kaboomer's Avatar
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    You got me psyched, John. I want to go punch something!

  21. #19
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    This is a great post. Thanks John for getting this out there. I am in Delaware County, and would like to be involved. I will PM you my contact information.
    "You cannot invade the mainland United States. There would be a rifle behind every blade of grass." - Admiral Isoruko Yamamota

  22. #20
    Major John Stark's Avatar
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    And just like that, we may have a venue where we can meet in private, and have some fun shooting as well, thanks to a forum member here who wants to help.

    If this pans out, I'll post details about the where, and we can then work on the when.
    "My soul is among lions; I must lie among those who breathe forth fire, even the sons of men, whose teeth are spears and arrows and their tongue a sharp sword." Psalm 57:4

    "Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils." -Major General John Stark

  23. #21
    Colonel loki34's Avatar
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    I feel any chance we have will be predicated on education. The general masses need to be educated on what they have already lost and what our government is trying to take away. Knowledge is power, and the liberals count on the ignorance of the common man.

  24. #22
    Major John Stark's Avatar
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    Another offer for a place to hold a get together from another forum member.

    There are good people here at NYF, and we're fortunate to have them on our side!
    "My soul is among lions; I must lie among those who breathe forth fire, even the sons of men, whose teeth are spears and arrows and their tongue a sharp sword." Psalm 57:4

    "Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils." -Major General John Stark

  25. #23
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    I'm listening and like what I hear.

    We all belong to multiple organization which support our beliefs. But I sometimes question if being so spread out is such a good idea especially when it comes to donations? Also we all belong to multiple forums related to our beliefs. I wonder how many of us are the same people on other forums? If we are the same people wearing different hats then that is an issue. We need to bring in new people.

    Perhaps the NYFirearm moderators could create a hometown section on this site so we can see who is local? Where are we strongest, upstate, downstate, how many in NYC etc?
    Or the moderators can provide a section with links to like minded websites. I'm thinking that there are many local websites, Facebook pages etc of local clubs that could be contacted and requested to unite as one. Perhaps by organizing on a more localized level that group could influence certain gun clubs and their ranges to share in our beliefs by becoming members and dictate by majority.

    I think at some point consolidation of like minded people could be a benefit especially when it comes to directing donations or to target politicians that oppose our beliefs.

    Also we are going to need politicians that are willing to put there careers on the line! Without them we are nothing!
    Last edited by Malcontent; 01-26-2014 at 11:57 AM.

  26. #24
    Major John Stark's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by flushermgti View Post
    I like your ideas, how will this organization differ from NYSRPA and SCOPE?
    We will seek, in part, to augment these and other fine organizations by driving our friends, family, and neighbors to choose the one they like the best.

    It will be a la carte, offering channels up for everyone's viewing pleasure to match their tastes rather than pushing channels in a big package no one wants or needs like the cable companies do.

    Think of it as a loosely organized volunteer Firearms association, like a volunteer fire company. The goal is not to stop others from fighting the fire, but getting others into their own fire trucks and to the scene to join in on the rescue.
    Last edited by John Stark; 01-26-2014 at 11:56 AM.
    "My soul is among lions; I must lie among those who breathe forth fire, even the sons of men, whose teeth are spears and arrows and their tongue a sharp sword." Psalm 57:4

    "Live free or die. Death is not the worst of evils." -Major General John Stark

  27. #25
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    I think its really great that members here feel the need to organize and promote positive gun ownership. Starting this kind of organized approach takes a lot of time and a huge effort to get it to where gun owners in NY need it to be. I am a recent SCOPE member and they are closely working directly with NY2A to organize efforts to gain positive outcomes at the next elections in NY. I believe that if a large number of NYFirearms members join SCOPE and get involved now, not just sending in a check, we can make a difference. I am not trying to thread jack, but they already have the ground work laid out as an organization that meets some of what is discussed in the OP. If NYFirearms members attend meetings and get involved now, with the efforts of SCOPE and NY2A, we may be able to make positive results in November. If enough members get involved in their local chapter, changes that have been discussed above might be able to be initiated and addressed. I'm not suggesting that a large number of NYFirearms members can take over their SCOPE chapter, but there is power in numbers. Being organized across the state is our best offense to gaining back our 2A rights.

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